This should stir the GM pot....

[Brebis]

Saw this in the Guardian.
An interesting way to save rare breeds of chickens by using sterile GM surrogate hens to develop follicles that have been harvested, frozen then implanted into the GM hen to produce eggs that can be hatched into the rare chicken. The GM hens have a gene removed to prevent them from making their own follicles.

There is already a "bank" collecting and storing rare breeds of poultry follicles (and I assume sperm too, cuz you can't have a fertile egg without the rooster!) that could be part of this technique.

https://www.theguardian.com/science/201 ... e_btn_link

[Maximus]

"Radical plan to maintain diversity of gene pool proposes use of genetically modified chickens as surrogate mothers"

This is lost on me. Diversity doesn't include (or shouldn't) GM. Their heritage is LOST once you mess with the genes.

Ok. Can't rant. Must walk away.

[windwalkingwolf]

Flawed idea. Not every follicle should become an egg, and not every egg should become a chick. There are a lot of reasons why a breed might be rare, and surrogacy won't fix any of them. The natural egg production and laying process naturally weeds out some of the defective genes, and I believe that surrogacy will just make a lot more very expensive little corpses. It's irrelevant if the surrogates are GM or not...If the breed is rare because of lack of interest, inherent problems or bottlenecking, hatching more won't fix those issues no matter which bird lays how many eggs.

[Brebis]

I think part of the idea is to have a bank of genetically rare birds that may be useful in the future similar to the seed bank in Norway to maintain genetic diversity.

They do mention that they think it may be possible to use it for other wild bird species that may near extinct if they can find a similar species close enough to be able to implant and lay the eggs successfully.

[Maximus]

How about we just behave responsibly. If we want heritage then we behave in a manner that keeps them here for centuries to come.

Ugh. This lack of logic has totally pissed me off. Someone lock me out of this thread. I feel a rant coming about responsible sustainable actions.

[MommaChick]

I see why everyone is cranky, but just because we are interested in preservation doesn't mean the big guys are. Because of commercial animal keeping, we have lost tons of great bloodlines. When the big guys are breeding in the thousands and we are breeding in the hundreds (if that) per year, we are going to surely lose. I think that trying to bank some genes has good intentions behind it. Once folks get used to the production qualities of hybrids, its hard to love a heritage breed that simply can't keep up.
I prefer the heritage breeds, but I can tell you that its a lot of extra time, work, and money to make their production worth thier keep.
I remember reading somewhere that because of commercial breeding operations, there is something like only 5 families of cows in North America now. (I know that is sooooo scientific of me to say, but I think you get my drift.) Yes we need to try harder, yes we need to stop looking for the quick and easy way out, but since we are and the big guys arent, why don't we do the next best thing and save some breeds while we can?

[Killerbunny]

QR_BBPOST How about we just behave responsibly. If we want heritage then we behave in a manner that keeps them here for centuries to come.

Why would we want to behave responsibly now? Don't even get me started on overpopulation.
The masses are unfortunately pushed into wanting cheap food and many have no option. However it makes me crazy around here sometimes when people are bitching they can't afford eggs/ chicken etc and are texting on their iphones!
Done now.

[Maximus]

QR_BBPOST

QR_BBPOST How about we just behave responsibly. If we want heritage then we behave in a manner that keeps them here for centuries to come.

Why would we want to behave responsibly now? Don't even get me started on overpopulation.
The masses are unfortunately pushed into wanting cheap food and many have no option. However it makes me crazy around here sometimes when people are bitching they can't afford eggs/ chicken etc and are texting on their iphones!
Done now.

I hear you there KB. However I will put a bit of a different perspective on it.
Having a cell phone with unlimited text is cheaper than having a landline in your home. Most people who are low income can't get a landline because the carrier needs a deposit, automated withdrawal or a credit card to take payments from, but anyone can get a prepaid cell phone.
If you want social benefits you have to have a phone number and an address.
The other issue is if you are unemployed you need some way to access the web to file for benefits and look for a job.
My daughter who is management for HMV will be out of a job soon. She doesn't have a computer or tablet and needs her phone to look for a job and file for benefits when/is that happens. So with her phone she can walk somewhere and get free wifi and look for a job. She has removed data from her plan and adjusted things accordingly.

People often make comments about cell phones because the perception is it is a luxury, but really a phone number is a necessity to get necessities. Cell phones are often the only choice when it comes to value and credit checks for people. You can not get a utility to heat/power your home without a contact number.

How do you apply for a job without a phone number?

Anyways, just wanted to put that out there.

[windwalkingwolf]

I don't see it as "preserving rare breeds"...If someone had an interest in bringing a rare breed of chicken back from the brink of disappearing, ideally that chicken would be recreated rather than drawing on already small gene pool. It's done all the time, every gene necessary to breed any chicken is out there.
I see this as an extreme form of hoarding.
These aren't giant pandas or Bengal Tigers. A chicken like the Lamonas doesn't disappear because we're destroying it's natural habitat, it disappears because we're tinkerers, lost interest and found something else to tinker with. A recreation is underway without the questionable help of sterile surrogate hens. Our need to muck about in things, to tinker, is the only reason removing perfectly good genes from a hen so they can lay another hen's eggs, is being considered. I'm not saying our desire to tinker is a bad thing.. or that GMOs necessarily are (you wouldn't have modern insulin without genetic modification)I'm saying in this case, it's unnecessary and even lazy.

[Ontario Chick]

QR_BBPOST I don't see it as "preserving rare breeds"...If someone had an interest in bringing a rare breed of chicken back from the brink of disappearing, ideally that chicken would be recreated rather than drawing on already small gene pool. It's done all the time, every gene necessary to breed any chicken is out there.
I see this as an extreme form of hoarding.
These aren't giant pandas or Bengal Tigers. A chicken like the Lamonas doesn't disappear because we're destroying it's natural habitat, it disappears because we're tinkerers, lost interest and found something else to tinker with. A recreation is underway without the questionable help of sterile surrogate hens. Our need to muck about in things, to tinker, is the only reason removing perfectly good genes from a hen so they can lay another hen's eggs, is being considered. I'm not saying our desire to tinker is a bad thing.. or that GMOs necessarily are (you wouldn't have modern insulin without genetic modification)I'm saying in this case, it's unnecessary and even lazy.

I want to "like" this twice!
..... only to add, what will happen to these precious birds after they are created.......?????