Medicated vs Nonmedicated feed...

User avatar
SandyM
x 4839

Medicated vs Nonmedicated feed...

Post by SandyM » Thu Apr 07, 2016 10:41 am

Thanks guys. It's kind of what I thought from my own research and personal experience.

So here's my other thing about medicated feed. With medicated feed you are actually killing good (and bad) bacteria and the good bacteria has an imperative role in any immune system. Essentially medicated feed is suppressing the immune system and not allowing immunity. Therefore once medicated feed is removed it takes time for good bacteria to replenish and for the immune system to develop strength again, putting the chick/pullet at further risk again until the good bacteria is back in balance.

Those chicks will all be together inventually and not all diseases/viruses are present immediately. So exposure at a young age has a higher chance for success, IMO, unless of course their immune systems are suppressed with medicated feed. Of course I wouldn't put a visibly weaker or Perceived ill chick in with a 'healthy' bunch, but if it was me I'd combine the groups and boost their immune system with probiotics, not suppress it with medication. Personally I'd rather lose a chick young than an older one. Survival of the strongest is kind of my mentality.

My crew get probiotics added to their feed DAILY and organic unpasteurized ACV to their water, which contains pre and probiotics. No medicated feed.

Also, what are we hiding when we feed medicated feed to chicks? Would a virus be expressed otherwise and the knowledge to remove the ill chick is being masked? Temporarily?

Just SOME of my points of views, thoughts etc.
2

User avatar
Ontario Chick
Poultry Guru
Posts: 5397
Joined: Sat Dec 12, 2015 10:12 am
Answers: 2
Location: Carp - West Ottawa
x 9618

Mixing chicks from different farms

Post by Ontario Chick » Thu Apr 07, 2016 10:59 am

I never feed medicated chick starter and this is a bit of a trip down memory lane but there are many newbies who may be interested.
Medicated feed was developed specifically for use in large production barns, where there was no space or time for the chicks to develop natural immunity, to avoid economical loses.
In the seventies I could walk in to any feed store and have a choice of medicated or non medicated feed, without any problem.
Then as the culture slowly changed it was simply easier for the feed store to carry only one type of feed and by default it was the medicated.
About 15 years ago it got so difficult to buy non medicated chick starter, that we were feeding duck starter to chicks to avoid meds.
Luckily the raising awareness and enough people asking for it, made the non medicated feed available in some feed stores again. Just my 2cents, sorry for the deflection. ;)
4

User avatar
thegawd
Head Cockerel-Moderator
Posts: 3658
Joined: Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:30 pm
Answers: 1
Location: Port Lambton
x 3739

Mixing chicks from different farms

Post by thegawd » Thu Apr 07, 2016 11:16 am

the medicated feed is only for coccisidios (sp?) its not a cover all... I dont feed it either. im now using masterfeeds. and guess what they have changed there package to 100% recyclable n added a statement to show their commitment to a sustainable future.

A very Wise man once told me to let the experts make the feed, there are many years of science behind them. something clicked in my head and it all made sense. I follow all the instructions on the bag and dont add anything at all.
Screenshot_2016-04-07-11-16-00-1882825023.png
2
Al

Home Grown Poultry

User avatar
Killerbunny
Poultry Guru - total zen level
Posts: 7869
Joined: Sat Dec 12, 2015 12:04 pm
Answers: 4
Location: Brockville
x 10155

Mixing chicks from different farms

Post by Killerbunny » Thu Apr 07, 2016 11:39 am

The medicated feed with Amprolium is a thiamine blocker which may not matter for a 6-8 week old meatie but I want my chicks to be able to metabolise properly.
2
:iheartpto:
Beltsville Small White turkeys.
Mutt chickens for eggs
RIP Stephen the BSW Tom and my coffee companion.
RIP Lucky the Very Brave Splash Wyandotte rooster.
RIP little Muppet the rescue cat.
:turkey:

:bat:

User avatar
Robbie
Head Chicken
Posts: 1390
Joined: Sat Dec 12, 2015 8:24 am
Answers: 1
Location: Cadmus, Ontario
x 867

Mixing chicks from different farms

Post by Robbie » Thu Apr 07, 2016 12:16 pm

The thing is, a chick that is loaded with coccidia will not thrive. They do horrific damage to the chick's gut. They are not harmless. Given the choice of two evils, Me personally, I'll take the amprolium. Feeding a high protein/fat diet will also help with low thiamine levels.......... besides, at recommended levels, apparently, amprolium does not interfere with the thiamin metabolism of the chicken (Scott, M.L., M.C. Nesheim, and R.J. Young. 1982. Nutrition of the Chicken. )
3
:sFun_mornincoffee:

User avatar
Killerbunny
Poultry Guru - total zen level
Posts: 7869
Joined: Sat Dec 12, 2015 12:04 pm
Answers: 4
Location: Brockville
x 10155

Mixing chicks from different farms

Post by Killerbunny » Thu Apr 07, 2016 3:23 pm

Robbie wrote:QR_BBPOST The thing is, a chick that is loaded with coccidia will not thrive. They do horrific damage to the chick's gut. They are not harmless. Given the choice of two evils, Me personally, I'll take the amprolium. Feeding a high protein/fat diet will also help with low thiamine levels.......... besides, at recommended levels, apparently, amprolium does not interfere with the thiamin metabolism of the chicken (Scott, M.L., M.C. Nesheim, and R.J. Young. 1982. Nutrition of the Chicken. )
Well they would say that wouldn't they! Looks like they were using meat chickens and Leghorns.
0
:iheartpto:
Beltsville Small White turkeys.
Mutt chickens for eggs
RIP Stephen the BSW Tom and my coffee companion.
RIP Lucky the Very Brave Splash Wyandotte rooster.
RIP little Muppet the rescue cat.
:turkey:

:bat:

User avatar
WLLady
Stringy Old Soup Pot Hen of a Moderator
Posts: 5613
Joined: Mon Dec 07, 2015 9:55 pm
Answers: 5
Location: Rural near West Lorne and Glencoe
x 8527

Mixing chicks from different farms

Post by WLLady » Thu Apr 07, 2016 3:36 pm

my medicated chick starter costs me less than the non medicated starter at my feed store, and has exactly the same thing in it with addition of only amprolium for coccidiosis. Having lost a large hatch once, due to putting purchased day old chicks infected with coccidiosis in with my own hatched chicks, and losing everyone, even after starting to treat with amprolium, i have opted to feed medicated starter regardless to everyone. i have not lost a single bird to coccidiosis since. nor have i had to treat for coccidiosis in adults since doing this-because i think the levels are low enough to let the chicks get nice and strong and then ward it off themselves as they grow. they are only on medicated feed for 8 weeks. to each their own, it's not right or wrong, just depends on how you want to start of your own chicks. i find this works for me very well, and if i don't do it, it doesn't work well. but i also have cats, dogs, turkeys, horses, not just chickens, so i have to watch for all sources of any infections, and nuke it fast before it makes the rounds.
6
:giraffe: Pet quality wheaten/blue wheaten ameraucanas, welsummers, barred rocks, light brown leghorns; Projects on the go: rhodebars, welbars

User avatar
Killerbunny
Poultry Guru - total zen level
Posts: 7869
Joined: Sat Dec 12, 2015 12:04 pm
Answers: 4
Location: Brockville
x 10155

Mixing chicks from different farms

Post by Killerbunny » Thu Apr 07, 2016 4:06 pm

The other thing is that the feed would (I hope) be balanced for the AMPROL. It's really a personal decision based on many factors as I said in my previous post. If I start to lose chicks to it I will likely have to go medicated. I was lucky when we moved here as there had been no poultry here ever. Now there are wild turkeys though. When we were rearing pheasants and partridge (a lot pickier) it was a constant fight for the greys and to a lesser extent the red legs to find a good balanced supplement to allow them to grow properly (and not cannibalise) so we worked with various feed mills at that time.
2
:iheartpto:
Beltsville Small White turkeys.
Mutt chickens for eggs
RIP Stephen the BSW Tom and my coffee companion.
RIP Lucky the Very Brave Splash Wyandotte rooster.
RIP little Muppet the rescue cat.
:turkey:

:bat:

User avatar
SandyM
x 4839

Mixing chicks from different farms

Post by SandyM » Thu Apr 07, 2016 4:27 pm

Ok, quick question again.
Surely there must be enough nutrients in a yolk that is their immune builder for the start off in life? Same as humans? We give some immunity to our newborns for the first 8 weeks I think it is?
0

User avatar
Killerbunny
Poultry Guru - total zen level
Posts: 7869
Joined: Sat Dec 12, 2015 12:04 pm
Answers: 4
Location: Brockville
x 10155

Mixing chicks from different farms

Post by Killerbunny » Thu Apr 07, 2016 4:28 pm

Interesting - I have no idea. Great question.
0
:iheartpto:
Beltsville Small White turkeys.
Mutt chickens for eggs
RIP Stephen the BSW Tom and my coffee companion.
RIP Lucky the Very Brave Splash Wyandotte rooster.
RIP little Muppet the rescue cat.
:turkey:

:bat:

Post Reply

Return to “Brooding and Broodies”